Here is the insightful interview with Cathy La Torre for De-LAB. We thank our guest for taking the time to chat with us. Happy reading!
Despite the proliferation of ESG policies dedicated to inclusion and respect for human rights—often promoted in Sustainability Reports—it is still very common to encounter cases of violence and discrimination in the workplace, with subtle and complex phenomena such as mobbing. In your opinion, what is still lacking at the legislative level to prevent these occurrences?
In my view, three main aspects are still missing: prevention, regulatory clarity, and enforcement. In summary:
- Enhancing prevention and corporate culture – Existing laws, such as Article 2087 of the Civil Code or Legislative Decree 81/2008 (the Consolidated Law on Workplace Safety), require employers to ensure a safe and respectful working environment. However, the application of these norms is often reactive rather than preventive. There is a lack of legislative tools that mandate companies to implement compulsory and periodic training programs on human rights, diversity, and the prevention of harmful behaviors.
Certifications such as the 2022 UNIPdR are gradually being introduced into corporate structures to bridge these gaps. However, since they are not legally binding like the aforementioned laws, their enforceability differs, and corporate culture still has a long way to go before fully assimilating these issues. - Regulatory clarity on mobbing – One of the most frequently requested consultation topics in my practice is mobbing. Although legally recognized in case law, mobbing still lacks a clear and unambiguous legal definition in our legal system. This creates difficulties for both victims and legal professionals. There is a need for a specific provision that clearly defines the identifying criteria of the phenomenon, distinguishes between vertical (from superiors) and horizontal (among peers) mobbing, and establishes clear sanctions and obligations for employers.
- Strengthening enforcement and sanctions – Many regulatory tools against discrimination, harassment, and mobbing already exist, but what is often missing is effective oversight, targeted enforcement, and a system of deterrent sanctions. A key issue is that victims of violence or mobbing often do not report incidents due to fear of retaliation or job loss, as mechanisms for anonymous internal or external reporting are often lacking or not well-publicized.
Thus, issuing generic norms for the protection of rights is not enough: a more specific, targeted, and preventive system is needed—one that promotes education and a culture of respect, alongside strong enforcement and clear, protective procedures for victims.
Looking beyond Italy, which other countries do you believe have particularly effective policies against gender discrimination, and why?
Several countries stand out for their advanced policies against gender discrimination. The Scandinavian countries, for example, are well known for their leadership in gender equality policies, thanks to a combination of stringent regulations, inclusive culture, and social investment.
Norway was among the first countries to introduce gender quotas on the boards of public and private companies (requiring at least 40% of members to be women). Moreover, compliance with these quotas is strictly enforced: companies that fail to meet the standards risk hefty fines or even closure. This model has proven beneficial not only for gender equality but also for business performance.
Iceland is another global leader in gender equality. A 2018 law mandates companies to obtain certification proving that they pay men and women equally for the same work (Equal Pay Certification). Non-compliant companies face financial penalties, ensuring full application of the law.
In your view, are certifications such as UniPDr 125 on Gender Equality structured to strengthen the prevention of workplace discrimination, or do they primarily serve compliance purposes without effectively preventing discrimination?
Certifications such as UNI/PdR 125:2022 on Gender Equality undoubtedly represent a significant step forward in promoting gender equity within organizations. However, their effectiveness depends on how they are implemented and integrated into corporate structures. In my opinion, they serve both compliance and preventive functions, albeit with some critical issues.
UNI/PdR 125 establishes a set of measurable requirements and indicators (KPIs) that companies must meet to obtain certification, covering areas such as career growth opportunities, pay equity, work-life balance policies, and the prevention and management of discrimination and harassment. From a regulatory perspective, the certification follows a compliance logic: it is designed to verify adherence to specific parameters, encouraging companies to adopt formal policies and internal processes.
Certified companies benefit from tangible advantages, such as preferential scoring in public tenders or tax incentives.
However, compliance tends to focus more on form than substance, leading some companies to pursue formal adaptation without fostering genuine cultural change. The certification relies on quantitative indicators which, if not complemented by qualitative monitoring, may fail to fully capture the internal workplace climate or effectively reduce discrimination.
Despite its compliance focus, UNI/PdR 125 has the potential to be preventive, particularly if companies understand its strategic value. The required indicators compel companies to measure and continuously monitor their gender equality performance, highlighting disparities before they escalate into explicit discrimination. When supported by genuine managerial commitment, certification can drive internal cultural transformation, raising awareness among employees and corporate leaders.
For example, a company that takes UNI/PdR 125 seriously will be motivated to:
- Train managers to recognize and prevent harassment or mobbing
- Invest in mentorship programs to break the glass ceiling
- Promote equal parental leave policies to balance work and family roles
However, for this to happen, certification must not be seen as merely a “quality seal” but as an integral part of corporate governance. Beyond data collection, it would be beneficial to implement periodic audits, anonymous employee surveys, and qualitative well-being assessments to ensure a deeper cultural commitment rather than mere regulatory compliance.
June has been declared “LGBT Pride Month,” and it is common to see employees of large and medium-sized companies wearing rainbow pins in support of the campaign. In your opinion, what is the boundary between genuine support and mere symbolic adherence, sometimes resulting in social-washing?
Pride Month provides companies with an opportunity to demonstrate their commitment to inclusion and human rights. However, the line between genuine support and mere symbolic gestures is often thin, and the risk of social-washing is real.
Social-washing occurs when organizations adopt inclusive symbols or messages (e.g., rainbow logos or Pride endorsements) without demonstrating a real, substantive commitment to LGBT+ rights. This can expose companies to reputational risks if their public messaging contradicts their internal practices or corporate leadership behavior. From a legal perspective, it may also entail liability if employees face discrimination or harassment based on sexual orientation or gender identity, contradicting the company’s purported values.
True support is demonstrated through tangible actions, such as:
- Corporate policies – Codes of ethics and internal regulations explicitly prohibiting discrimination
- Anti-discrimination procedures – Anonymous reporting mechanisms and protections for employees facing homophobia or transphobia
- Inclusive HR practices – Equal opportunities in hiring, promotion, and pay structures
- Fair employee benefits – Equal parental leave and healthcare benefits for same-sex couples
- Community engagement – Funding LGBT+ initiatives, mentorship programs, or partnerships with advocacy organizations
To avoid social-washing, companies must go beyond symbolism and integrate inclusion into their core values, ensuring that support for the LGBT+ community is a structural commitment rather than a mere marketing strategy.
Gender discrimination is increasingly under the spotlight for large companies in both Italy and abroad. How can SMEs be made more aware and engaged on these issues in a concrete way?
SMEs often lack the organizational and financial resources of larger companies, making gender equality a challenging but crucial issue. Raising awareness and engagement among SMEs is essential not only for protecting fundamental rights but also for enhancing competitiveness and innovation.
Concrete actions to involve SMEs include:
- Financial incentives – Tax breaks for companies that promote equal pay and invest in diversity training
- Public procurement advantages – Preferential treatment in tenders for inclusive businesses
- Free or subsidized training programs – Providing SMEs with accessible resources to foster inclusivity
- Success stories and best practices – Showcasing SMEs that have benefited from inclusive policies
- Simplified regulations and consultancy support – Helping SMEs navigate gender equality initiatives
To be effective, gender equality must be framed as a strategic business advantage rather than just a regulatory requirement. Increasingly, consumers and business partners evaluate companies based on ethical standards, including gender inclusivity. Demonstrating that inclusion is a tangible opportunity—not just a bureaucratic obligation—will help even smaller businesses actively engage in overcoming gender discrimination.
Could you recommend a book and a film that would help us better understand your work and the topics discussed in this interview?
BOOKS:
- “Ci sono cose più importanti” by Cathy La Torre (2022) – In this book, I outline a journey through rights that can no longer wait.
- “Nessuna causa è persa” by Cathy La Torre (2022) – Civil and social rights in our country are constantly under attack, while laws aimed at inclusion and integration are being challenged and postponed.
- “Americanah” by Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie – This novel, through the experiences of its protagonist, explores gender and racial discrimination, intertwining them with the theme of cultural identity. It offers an international perspective on rights and inclusion.
MOVIES:
- “Poor Things” (2023) – Directed by Yorgos Lanthimos, this film touches on numerous themes, including the fight against stereotypes, diversity and gender identity, sexual freedom, and female empowerment.
- “C’è ancora domani” (2023) – Set in 1940s Rome, this film (directed by and starring Paola Cortellesi) explores various issues, including gender-based violence and women’s rights to vote and education. It aims to shed light on past gender inequalities, some of which unfortunately still persist today.
- “Hidden Figures” (2016) – This film tells the true story of three African American women mathematicians who worked at NASA in the 1960s, overcoming gender and racial discrimination to make crucial contributions to the U.S. space program.